Here's a problem that's bugged me in the past, and I can't remember if there's a solution or not.

Here goes, I'm working on a tune and have been putting tracks down one by one. No style backing tracks involved, and no percussion.

I know certain instruments should be on certain tracks, which may be the cause of the problem I'm not sure.

Anyway, I've got a 'mega' guitar on track 16. (Edit: this should read Super Articulated, not mega). On playback, all is ok until I record another instrument on a different track. (I should have mentioned the guitar part is not the only track. I have el. pno, strings, bass and a couple of other things going on).

Now, on playback the 'mega' (SA) has gone and I'm left with a semi-accoustic sounding guitar.

Weird thing is, occasionally if I go to the Song Creator, select Channels 1/16, change the track to 16, as if I'm going to edit the track, then sometimes the guitar plays back correctly.

I seem to remember John Wyvern on the old forum saying something about it's the way the Tyros handles DSP events in a certain order ??

I've tried muting any tracks that are not in use, and also making sure no instrument is looking for more processing power by turning off any DSP effects, other than a little reverb.

It gets weirder - I tried switching the guitar to a non-mega voice, i.e. Smooth Lead. Again it works until I save the song and then it defaults to the original guitar without the mega effects. (I'm after the distortion).

I wondering if I can get this guitar part to track 1, if that'll make any difference? (Is there any way of swapping 2 tracks in the Tyros, without having to use a DAW?).

Any ideas anyone?

Cheers

Paul

Hi Paul
I think Mark Styles is the best person to answer this as he has used mega voice guitars in his multi-tracking.
Mega guitars I believe are specifically designed for styles and not for melodies, something to do with the velocity switching for various effects. I think as long as you steer clear of Ch 9 & 10 which are primarily percussion channels you should be ok.
You can copy a channel to another channel (then delete the original) by going to Song Creator tab to CHANNEL then use [BUTTON B] to scroll to [3 MIX] Select [SOURCE 1] as the channel you want to copy and [SOURCE 2] as the destination channel and also set the destination channel in the 3rd column. Press EXECUTE. Then delete the original channel.
If you want to mix 2 channels they must be the same voice just select the second channel as [SOURCE 2) and the desination channel where you wish both of them to end up. Dont forget to press [EXECUTE] then [SAVE]
Cheers
Spike

Hi Spike,

I know what you mean however, I think these are the guitars that are listed at the end of the guitar section. The mega guitar hero, (which is the one I'd like to use), is on the first page. I've used it on a track before with ok results. Trying to use the ones at the back of the list is near impossible, unless you know how to use them like Mark does. (It's the same with the saxes. The first one in the list is a 'mega voice' and is perfectly playable, whereas the ones at the back of the list are hard work!). The guitar I'm having a problem with at the moment is one of the 'cool' series, (Smooth Lead), which should be perfectly playable, but loses the distortion part of the voice on playback.

I'm sort of sure it has something to do with the Tyros allocating DSP resources to tracks in order, (?), and with this track being on Ch. 16, (I originally had it on Ch. 8), I think maybe all the resources have been used up. I should imagine certain el. pianos use quite a bit of processing so if I can move the piano track out of the way, who knows it might just work.

Thanks for this info, I'm going to try and get the guitar track into ch. 1 tonight and see if this makes a difference.

Cheers

Paul

Hi Paul
I'm a bit confused here, your Guitar Hero voice is a Super Articulated voice not a Mega Voice and I'm not sure if you can put an SA voice into a style channel (I may be wrong).
Your Smooth Lead guitar in my T2 isn't a cool voice but just an ordinary bog standard one with a bit of distortion which incidentally disappears if you switch off the DSP. I therefore suspect you are right - too many DSP effects.
Cheers
Spike

I always get these mixed up! (I'd better change the thread title also).

I'm sure you can use them as I've used them in the past, especially the first sax in the list which is an SA version. I also use the SA brass, (for the shaky trumpets).

Cheers Spike,

Paul

If it loses the distortion, then it's most likely to do with the effects.. I would take note of the dsps, being used, and the levels being sent to them, then change the patch for next track and check back to see if the effects and the levels sent have been changed. I'm guessing that when you select a different instrument it is changing the dsp for what it needs.

I 'think' (not positive) the only restriction you have is Channel 10 needs to be rhythm.
Any other channel can be assigned to whatever you need.

The mega voices are very hard if not impossible to control live.. Cause if you look at the data list pdf. Some of them have a velocity margin of 10 to get a certain sound (gtr harmonic) and this range is narrowed even more by the fact that some of those tricks need an exact velocity to sound at the proper level..

You could play a part using a normal voice and then switching it to a mega and manually adjusting velocities, to suit your needs, but it would be excruciating using Tyros editor I would think.. (again I am only using an external DAW to edit note events)

You may have to reassign some parameters to find a happy medium. Or

Well, the plot thickens. Whatever I did last night I just couldn't get the recorded guitar part on ch. 16 to play back correctly, i.e. with the DSP effects.

I even tried deleting every other track, moving the guitar part to track 1, (thanks for the instructions Spike), but still the part wouldn't work.

I then loaded up the song from scratch, muted ch. 16 and then recorded a part on track 12 using SA Guitar Hero. I quickly recorded the midi to audio, in case the Guitar Hero effects did the usual disappearing act. I saved the midi, loaded a different song, then loaded the first one again and SA Guitar Hero still played back correctly! Weird.

So it looks as though the gremlins decided my original track 16 was never going to happen.

Anyway, all ok now. Thanks again for your help guys.

I just have another question for Spike.

In Song Creator > Channels 1-16 I've figured out how to move around this area, (having selected the correct midi channel for working on), and wondered how you 'push' a note. What I mean is: I have a prominent note, (which I can't re-record as there is a long sustain from the previous note), that comes in a fraction too early, and I want to delay this note being played by roughly quarter of a beat or so.

I can't quantise the note as all parts have been played in freestyle, so no beat to work to.

Cheers

Paul

P.S. I have another question about sustaining notes in the song creator, but I'll save that until I get my head around the above issue first.

Hi Paul
Very simple to do
Go to Song Creator, tab to page [1-16], select the Channel that the duff note is on. You will probably already know which bar the note occurs in so scroll down the event list using [BUTTON B] until you come to the bar.
The first 3 columns are Measure (bar) : Beat : Tick. There are 1920 ticks to a beat . Assuming you think that the note is 1/4 of a beat out then you should delay that note by 1920/4 = 480 ticks so lets say the figures of the first four columns read
024:3:1101
You scroll horizontally using [BUTTONS C or D] until the 1101 is highlighted.
You then use either the [DATA ENTRY] wheel or [BUTTONS 4 & 5] to increase that figure until it reads 1581 (1101 + 480) ie you are moving the note towards the next beat (:4: ). Incidentally by highlighting other columns you can change notes, CCs,velocities, pan values and in the last 2 columns the length and sustain of the note.
Scroll back to a couple of bars before your edited note and play the song. If the note needs further adustment then repeat the above moving the timing of the note until it's right.
Press [SAVE]
Hope this is clear
Cheers
Spike

Pefectly!

You've also answered my other upcoming question about how to sustain a note. I tried altering one of the columns, but only got as far as 127 so having read your post it looks like I was changing the velocity, not the sustain. I didn't touch the last two rows, thinking they were something to do with voice banks or something. Now I know I can change the length and sustain of a note that will be a big help.

I've tried opening the manual, but the eyes tend to glaze over before I get past the index!

Cheers again,

Paul